Adding EMC to items

Discussion in 'Tekkit Server' started by Mysteryem, 28 Oct 2012.

  1. Mysteryem The Dividing Line

    I am going to be installing on the tekkit server, which, among exploit fixes and general server improvements, includes the ability to both change the EMC of items, and add emc to items which didn't have it in the first place.

    One thing to remember when giving items emc values, is how it's all about the equivalence of items. For example, I could make it so that gold ore is worth 2048 emc, then, you could make gold ingots from it without needing to smelt it. However, using the ore in a macerator yields 2 gold dust, which has a combined emc total of 4096, with this, you could then make 2 gold ore, which would then go to make 4 gold ore and so on. This is a problem since it would create a very efficient and overpowered machine, just like the OP Machines from the previous map.

    So then, you would think, why not make the ore 4096 to take this into account? Well, you either need an RM furnace or a macerator to do this, one requires you to have done some IC2 stuff, and the other is a very high end EE block. Adding this emc value would make these items not as useful anymore. For the reasons above, this is why I would suggest things like ores, not having emc values.

    If anyone has any suggestions for items to add, or reasons not to add some of these, post away.

    Here is my suggested list of items to have emc values:
    Items requiring made up EMC values
    Sponge: Once you have an alchemical tome or a friend who does, now you can get sponge legit.
    Snow(thin snow on the ground): Decorative
    Chain armour
    Items requiring calculated emc values depending on what they are crafted from:
    Ruby, emerald and sapphire blocks: The gems already have emc values themselves.
    Infernal Brick
    Copper Block
    Tin Block
    Bronze block:
    (Uranium block not included, since it requires refined uranium to make)
    Wooden Scaffolds
    Buildcraft gears
    Pipe waterproof
    World Anchor
    Dimensional anchor
    Obsidian stick
    Stone bowl
    REther pearl
    Musket Barrel
    Musket Round
    Crossbow bolt
    Poisonous dart
    Fire rod
    Blunderbuss shot
    Blunderbuss barrel
    Bronze armour
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  2. Harv Admiral Anchovy

    I've got two similar suggestions:

    First, it would be GREAT to give Coolant cell an EMC value.
    If that's not possible for some reason (though currently I don't see any misuse probability, but haven't given much though of it either) add EMC to water cells.
    Creating Water cell is a pain in the ass in the first place, but compressing it to coolant cell takes pain in the assness on a new level.

    Of course the best option would be to add EMC to both of them.
  3. Mysteryem The Dividing Line

  4. Harv Admiral Anchovy

    I'd suggest generator, geothermal generator, and the other similar machines as well, calculated by the ingredients' EMC values. Refined uranium is only mentioned at the uranium block part, but if I recall correctly that also doesn't have an EMC and sure it would come handy. :)
  5. nlspeed Rex Omnium Imperarum

    I was about to suggest some items, but then I read your list. One question; why not simply everything?

    Yeah yeah, 'cheating', but then you might as well disable Condensers and Collectors.

    On the other hand, I could just set up Condensers with all the materials I need to craft something, and put an Crafting Table MK3 next to it, so I suppose the trouble of calculating everything out isn't worth it.

    One final note; who cares about exploits?

    I personally have never used them, and I can't say that at some point into the very far future I'd like to set up such machines. Not because they are exploits, but because... Well, why would I? I really don't care whether it's possible or not, but that isn't the point. Point is, you seem to be struggling (so to say) with balancing EMC values. Well, why? If you know of an exploit and feel it's too exploitive to use, you don't. If others like to use it, then they do.

    We aren't a PvP server where people fight, and I frequently donate stacks of Red Matter or whatever to people who ask - who're 'exploiting my EMC flowers'. :P

    I don't care, but you seem to have spent quite some time on it. If you want to, great, but why bother?

    Good idea anyway! I especially love the Chain Armour and Snow (and Sponge I suppose).
  6. coffeejunky GM's Tea-boy

    I don't want to see everything have an emc value. The list in the first post looks fine. Can we add concrete and rebar as an emc value too.
  7. Mysteryem The Dividing Line

    The main problem is, you're skipping out on multiple steps of crafting and smelting, and I don't think everyone is going to want to people who focus solely on EE to have an easy time in IC2. Unless of course, they do.

    Currently, most mods have some raw materials with EMC values and that's it.

    Using the uranium block as an example, the single EMC conversion would be equivalent to creating 9 uranium ore from EMC, then putting each one through an extractor, and then crafting them. This would require the player to build a system whereby items are generated in a condenser, sent to an extractor, then sent to an automatic crafting table and then, finally, sent to a chest to store the uranium blocks in.

    Some of the others are even more complicated, e.g., a single low voltage solar panel or even a high voltage one. Most of the modular force field blocks are very complex as well.

    All crafting, and running items through machines, must not increase the EMC value at all. A uranium block would merely cost 9*uranium ore.

    I'll see if I can set up a poll. edit: can't
    I did consider concrete and rebars on my first run through, though they require the use of a rolling machine. Tbh, the rolling machine is just a pain, it should just be replaced with a normal crafting table.

    I will add concrete and the rebar, and the world anchor to my current file.
  8. nlspeed Rex Omnium Imperarum

    Yeah, and if not for the Crafting Table MK3, that arguement would hold water. As I said; I could just find out exactly what materials (with EMC) I need to get HV Solar Panels, generate all of those, and put a Crafting Table MK3 near by. It'd only require a few clicks more than if the HV Solar Panel had an EMC value.

    And what about, say, the use of Furnaces? Because they use coal, yet if you input multiple items fast enough, you can use the same coal for more than one item. That is exploitable no matter what.

    I suppose I'm playing devil's advocate here though, I don't care much one way or another. It's just that, to me, this whole EMC business is unfixable short of removing the EMC value of quite some items, and I just don't see why you'd spend so much time trying to figure it out. Good luck though!
  9. Mysteryem The Dividing Line

    Using a furnace of other machine will always be slightly lossy, but you will only use up a somewhat negligible amount. Using machines, loses you a slight bit of EMC, transmuting the item from one form to its post-furnace form costs nothing. Blaze rods were an example of whereby the macerated blaze powder produced and EMC gain, from this, you could make more blaze rods, and therefore, have an infinite gain.

    Even with the crafting table mk3, not all of the required materials are raw materials in the first place. E.g., you must make coal dust from coal, refined iron from iron and rubber from sticky resin. The crafting table III only considered crafting, and none of the other processes. Creating an HV solar panel with the crafting table III took a much longer time than it would take if it had an emc value.

    EE is disabled on most servers, both because of the exploits and bugs, but also because of how much easier it makes the other mods, this just makes it even easier.
  10. nlspeed Rex Omnium Imperarum

    Mhm, that is true, yeah.

    And yeah, I know that, and to be honest, I find that to be one of the more stupid things I've seen. This is Minecraft, it's about building huge and awesome stuff. Tekkit, for me, is EE, purely because it enables you to actually do that in a reasonable amount of time. I mean, if I want to make a golden building, I'd have to mine for months in normal Minecraft, and that goes against everything that Minecraft is for me.

    Of course, others can (and do, I suppose) have a different opinion, but still.
  11. I've got this problem.. the Emc value isn't showing up anymore. like in the past when i hovered my mouse over an item i would see the emc value.. well that's not happening anymore
  12. Harv Admiral Anchovy

    Do we still have a Tekkit server?
  13. No :<
  14. Harv Admiral Anchovy

    Well that explains it then.
  15. Are you talking about the GM tekkit? Because that isn't up anymore.
  16. Queenie Don't tell me what to do!!!

    It wouldn't have been so bad that you resurrected this thread if you had at least had something constructive to say and or add.

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